Admin from LemmyNSFW here, not the one that posted but an admin nonetheless.
I’m not really down with this being presented as drama as some are trying to, it’s unfortunate the way it played out but overall its their choice to defederate. We actively encourage other instances who forbid pornography to defederate from us. Lemmy.ml, sopuli, etc etc we are totally fine with, we have no malice or hate towards them because thats their choice and their reasons and concerns for doing so are more than legitimate especially with how limited lemmy is right now and the locations that they host their site at. We have open discussions with other instance admins and welcome discussions of their potential concerns, it’s just we didn’t really know what the concerns were beyond “this looks wrong because it looks wrong delete it” which made it extremely frustrating to try to figure out concisely what the problem was so we could address it.
My only issue is it being presented as if we are fine with CSAM, when we aren’t and to be accused of that is extremely serious.
My only issue is it being presented as if we are fine with CSAM, when we aren’t and to be accused of that is extremely serious.
I acted on the report I received, which wasn’t for the jailbait community.
There is no jailbait community on lemmynsfw as far as I can tell. Jailbait is by definition underage girls and falls under CSAM and you can have your own thoughts about fauxbait, I absolutely do, but the fact of the matter is the whole point is that it’s fake and these are adult women.
There’s some inherent reality/fantasy disconnect that Ada has here.
I’m not really down with this being presented as drama as some are trying to
I know and I appreciate you taking a mature and reasonable stance on all this and my point in posting this here wasn’t to make something out of nothing or create outrage or anything like that. It’s just that this isn’t nothing, it looks like there might be ulterior motives and reasons that were not made clear here and this was just an excuse and a lot of this just reeks of goofy Leddit powermod behavior and logic that doesn’t hold up to scrutiny. That’s all.
It makes me sad, but it is what it is. I’m trying not to take it personally, but it does sting since I am a gay man, and an LGBT focused instance is a lovely idea in my eyes. We do not have a jailbait community, whatsoever. There are concerns about fauxbait that we are actively discussing and navigating. It did bring up a good conversation on that end at least.
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Apparently women are able to be independent and fully able to choose, but only up to the point we allow them
I really want to thank you for the levelheadedness you’re bringing in.
Perhaps that’s a learned behaviour from other networks where drama=engagement=upvotes. I don’t know. But reading your comment filled me with gratitude.
It’s reassuring to see these technicalities being taken for what they are. Different people have different needs. Understanding that makes respecting those needs something simple and natural. Each to their own, right?
tl; dr?
Thank you for your levelheadedness.
Thank you and absolutely! Our general ethos for LemmyNSFW is that with the implosion of reddit, it’s inevitable that some adults are going to seek out adult content so making sure its done right is quite important. For the purpose of the growth of the lemmyverse and keeping the community safe, we see it as an opportunity to not only learn from reddits biggest mistakes and make a new community that focuses consent and keeps minors out, but also actually attempts to foster a safe and controlled environment that other federated NSFW communities haven’t really been able to do so as they have almost always turned into a free for all. It’s an uphill battle with the limits of lemmy, but we are working through it and doing the best we can and building tools for ourselves. There isn’t a blueprint for this, we’re learning as volunteers as time goes on.
When it comes to defederation, we truly don’t have issues with instances that defederate with us. There’s no hard feelings, no grudge, not even any ounce of negativity. We respect and honor that choice, and with the limits that lemmy has (especially right now) we understand why instances make that choice. And for the overall benefit and safety of the lemmyverse there needs to be instances that don’t federate with us too. Especially in line with our focus on consent. Ideally, there will be native ways in lemmy to block our instance, restrict our content in all for instances, and the implementations of more detailed content warnings.
I will say that I personally use a different instance for SFW stuff, and I can say that I absolutely adore the people at aussie.zone, sopuli.xyz & feddit.de. The admins and communities at each of those instances are filled to the brim with absolute sweethearts and I have nothing but love and kindness towards them. It makes me sad when people feel there is some weird beef we have with the instances that have us defederated (especially those!), and I hope those instances know we don’t, we fully understand why they do, and we will never push them to refederate with us unless they inquire to us explicitly about thinking about doing so.
Same as above, if we were simply defederated there would have been no hard feelings, it was everything else that was an issue.
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So, first, just turn off “show NSFW” in your profile settings, but yes, even then I agree there really needs to be a way for users to block instances. Defederating is such a massive thing. Having more granular options would be nice. I don’t think it would’ve changed this particular case but it can change more.
Removed by mod
I know it may seem like empty platitudes, but I want to make it clear for anyone reading this that our entire team agrees with more native ways in lemmy to block our instance as well as ways for instances to limit our content from federating into the all page. The fact that there is a lack of distinction between NSFW and pornographic content is extremely problematic as well, and ideally long term lemmy will receive content warnings like other activitypub platforms.
Porn isn’t for everyone, but people are going to seek it out regardless. A space such as lemmyNSFW needs to exist to allow the people who seek such content out to be able to do so in a safe and controlled environment that focuses consent as a key principle. And in line with having the key princple being consent, making sure people who do not want to see content from our instance are able to block such content with ease is a no brainer.
Our team has also taken a step back and looked to what critiques there are in regard to our instance, as well as preemptively engaging with other instance admins as well. The conversations being had are important, and we are actively figuring out how to best navigate them.
Also, heres a reply I made 20 days ago to the connect apps comm when a proposal was made to block instances. Where I reiterate what I said above. https://lemmy.ca/comment/857085
Switch to lemmy.blajah.zone and you’ll never see them again.
Okay, now how do we block blahaj.zone content, as a lemmy.world user?
I’m on Jerboa, but there’s an option to block instances in the meatball menu of a post. I use it to hide foreign language instances like .nl and .de
On a non-serious note, I’ve never heard it referenced as a “meatball menu” and I absolutely love it. It makes sense given the similar term “hamburger menu” too!
What/where is the meatball menu please?
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Because I don’t care to interact with content from an instance run by Ada.
redacted
So blahaj.zone defederated a whole instance because one community on lemmynsfw has pictures of (verified) adults that don’t look adult enough? That seems… extreme, and rather insulting to the women whose bodies/appearances are supposedly too close to actual children to be worthy of attraction. Glad that’s not my instance, though to each their own.
If it’s as presented in the quote then yeah, this feels like that australian porn law they tried where “if you look like you could be underage, it counts as child sex material” and one specific example from the text was “too small or flat breasts”. Which was just patently absurd.
I seem to remember a guy being convicted for possession of child porn, and the very much adult porn star actually came to his trial to testify in his defense… I’ll see if I can find a link about it, but that will be some risky searching.
Lupe something.
And he wasnt convicted, but was going to. The state had a “medical expert” show up and testify that there was no way an adult woman could look like that. Just 100% sure of himself and smug as fuck about it.
Then the defense called the pornstar to the stand and she was in her late 20s or something and working in the industry for over a decade.
It was something that never should have made it to trial, and gets used a lot as an example for how shit expert testimony can be. The prosecution doesn’t try to find the person who knows the most, they find whoever can do the best job of convincing a jury that the prosecution is right. So the people who do it (some are professional “expert witnesses”) are just the most overconfident people. Even if they’re not sure, they play it up that there can’t be any doubt.
Ah, found the story. That is wild. Also amazing of her to actually fly over to testify, I thought it was in her own country or something. Amazing person! <3
Lupe Fuentes. What’s worse is that she was already registered in multiple US studios since she made films here, too, so the prosecution could have easily verified her documents, which the defense attorney asked her to do. Instead, she had the CBP agent who made the arrest and an “expert” doctor testify that Lupe couldn’t have been more than 13.
Good article on it here: https://reason.com/2010/05/03/porn-star-saves-man-from-incom/
That crap is borderline Puritanism, wtf is wrong with people?
There’s some further correspondence in the linked post, and yeah that’s basically what it boiled down to. What a strange world. I can’t believe that’s a real law.
lawmakers are not intelligent or discerning people
They’re pandering to voters with laws like that. The politicians probably don’t care.
Makes the story about ChatGPT passing the bar exam a lot less impressive.
Those changes were the sole reason women in the media in australia got bigger tits all of a sudden. Nice!
God I feel so bad for all the women who were in the “illegally small boobs” category. Therapist and psychiatrist visits must have skyrocketed.
I could understand it if it were over an actual “fake jailbait” or “drawn little girls” community, that would make way more sense than this.
I’m looking at it right now and the vast majority of the posts there are clearly adult women and the ones that look young like Hannah Hayes are pretty easily verifiable adult performers. Also their tone in demanding them to purge a community and all their users when they’re so off base is absurd.
This all seems very goofy. This Ada person lives in a weird reality and I wish them the best.
And to think Hannah Hayes is quite old in Porn industry terms. She should be doing milf vids in about 2 to 4 years if my calculations are correct.
Lemmynsfw literally has a community called fauxbait.
That’s fair. So why not cite that particular community and ask for its removal instead of this one?
I’m thinking that they may have either made a mistake in picking another community, or that they saw what they thought was content from that community and called it out immediately. Let’s not forget that if anything Lemmy is less immune to the moderator god complex than Reddit. Since most “mods” of Lemmy/fediverse instances are also paying a physical price they feel even more attacked. Rather than just announcing simply “Blahaj has defederated from Lemmynsfw” they made a whole post about it and then talked at length about culture war stuff. A simple “Blahaj states their reason for defederating is due to our hosting of potentially illegal content. We want to remind our subscribers and user that lemmynsfw does NOT support illegal content, will NOT host it and will remove anything that violates the law.” They chose to take it as an insult. It’s just business.
Rather than just announcing simply “Blahaj has defederated from Lemmynsfw” they made a whole post about it
Alas, Lemmy does not provide a way of making a local only post, or that is how it would have been done.
I acted on the report I received, which wasn’t for the jailbait community. At that time, I didn’t even know the jailbait community existed. However, it’s continued existence validates my initial concerns
So you didn’t even look into it at all before making demands about purging a community and all its users. Very cool.
Also don’t call it “a jailbait community”. Yeah it’s gross, but the whole point is that it’s adult women, hence the “faux”. Can’t believe I have to defend creeps against a person like you. There’s something very off with you.
You asked for an explanation. I provided one. You respond with personal attacks
After looking at your explanation, yes. Correct. Good job.
I assumed until someone said the problem community was adorableporn that the problem was fauxbait. Fauxbait gives me seriously sceevy vibes and I ended up blocking it on all three of my accounts (I think. If I havent I will)
The name REALLY doesn’t help. Like, I know the women there are not under age for the most part because I have seen them around since I was in my 20s, which was 20 years ago. It’s not my thing, but there are people who are attracted to slimmer proportions so whatever. Still, the name makes it sound like it’s a CP false flag site.
First of all I want to make it clear that I don’t agree with this defederation, if the models are verified adults then there is no problem.
That said, as a Mastodon instance admin, I wanna explain something to y’all. CSAM is one of those things that you do not want to take your chances with as an admin. Beyond the obvious fact that it’s vile, even having that shit cached on your server can potentially lead to very serious legal trouble. I can see how an admin might choose to defederate because even if right now all models are verified, what if something slips through the cracks (pun not intended, but I’ll roll with it).
My instance defederates a bunch of Japanese artist instances like pawoo because of this. All it takes is one user crossing the line, one AI generated image that looks too real.
Aside from all that, there’s also a lot of pressure being put on many instance admins to outright ban users and defederate instances that post or allow loli/shota artwork as well. You’re quickly labeled a pedophile if you don’t do it. A lot of people consider fake CSAM to be just as bad, so it’s possible that the other admin felt that way.
I’m more lenient on loli/shota as long as it’s not realistic because I understand that it’s a cultural difference and generally speaking Japanese people don’t see it the way we do. I don’t ban stuff just because I think it’s gross, I just don’t look at it.
Anyway what I’m trying to say I guess is that being an admin is hard and there’s a lot of stuff y’all don’t know about so disagree with that person if you want (I do too) but keep in mind that these decisions don’t come easy and nobody likes to defederate.
EDIT: here’s a mastodon thread about the CSAM problem in the fediverse if you’d like to learn more.
If they offered that as explanation there would have been no drama.
Well yeah I’m not like defending them or anything. I just kind of understand where they’re coming from too.
Yeah, but on the other hand it is verifiably not CSAM
The problem is that if it’s hard to tell at a glance, there’s no way to know if actual CSAM gets uploaded there in the future. So what it boils down to is, is it worth the risk? That admin says no, it isn’t, so they defederate.
My Mastodon instance defederates pretty much any instance that allows sexually explicit or suggestive artwork or photos of people who look underage. It’s just not worth it.
then why even federate at all? someone else could post CSAM at any time
I can’t tell if you’re trying to be funny or not but I’ll answer anyway.
There’s a difference between federating with instances that disallow any pornography featuring models/characters/etc who look underage, and federating with instances that allow that type of material. Actual CSAM will be immediately obvious and handled very quickly on the first, but not necessarily on the latter instance.
It’s pretty much standard practice for Mastodon/*key/whatever admins to defederate instances that allow lolicon/shotacon and anything else like that. There are curated block lists out there and everything, we’ve been doing it for years while still federating and we’re doing just fine.
One post in one community and the title of the community.
I didn’t notice that blahaj defederated from us so much.
I think this is an area where there is legitimate debate. They didn’t name the community, but I’m guessing it’s fauxbait, which has in the sidebar:
FauxBait is a place for sharing images and videos of the youngest-looking, legal-aged (18+) girls. If you like fresh, young starlets, this is the place for you!
The title seems to be for “fake jailbait,” so I can understand people assuming it’s essentially simulated underage porn. There will be those who say that as long as the models are legal, it’s fine, and others who say it’s not okay to make what looks like child porn, even if it’s not made with children.
I personally feel that, as long as they’re up front about it being adults, it’s okay for it to exist, even though some of the pics there are a bit gross to me. But I get that people will fall to the left and right of me. If it crosses a line for the admin there, defederating seems reasonable (since they can’t block the community at the instance level).
The community was [email protected]
Nothing to do with jailbait
Where did she say that? The admin post I saw didn’t name it. Adorableporn makes no sense since half the pics there are clearly older women.
Look at the link in the OP here…
Look at the link in the OP here…
Look at the link in OP you are commenting on lol
Imbecil
The community in question is “adorable porn”, from what I’ve read.
The concept of which is attractive but bubbly/cute women in nsfw circumstances.
I’m the new mod of [email protected], (not to be confused with [email protected]) , and since the female gender does not have a monopoly on the word “adorable”, the community is inclusive of all genders.
I welcome all to join in the conversation at pinned post in the community: https://lemmynsfw.com/post/419923
Well that just makes no sense and makes me question the accuracy. I’m not sure that community even skews particular young, though probably at least a little… Adorable doesn’t necessarily mean young and young doesn’t necessarily mean adorable.
The accuracy? Admin posted the conversation
Oh, I hadn’t seen the conversation screenshot. It honestly so much doesn’t make sense that I’m wondering if she linked the wrong sub. I mean, scroll through that one - lots and lots of the posts are cute housewives.
Fauxbait, on the other hand, I could see being debatable. How could they have a problem with the one and not the other? Something doesn’t add up.
They did not link the wrong community. It’s just stupid, nothing more
I thought it was a different community that was causing the issues; the reaction makes much more sense with that one. While I still don’t agree with the defederation it’s not nearly as unreasonable as it first seemed to me. Thanks for clearing that up.
Edit - nevermind, it actually was adorableporn, so yeah still weird.
Full disclosure, I’m guessing - the admin post about it didn’t name the community, but she said something about “intentionally looking underage” or something like that, which is why I assumed fauxbait.
As a woman who spent a good chunk of her adult life looking like a child I had to deal with a lot of pedos on MySpace etc trying to get sick pictures from me. Most of them fucked off once I told them I was in my 20s… it’s disturbing and I find the idea that someone can find childlike attributes attractive to be repulsive. It’s not ok to simulate racism or bigotry for the pleasure of racists and bigots, why is it ok to simulate CP?
So presumably you are repulsed by your partners right?
Like when did the conversation become purely about physical appearance, and instead of the actual moral implications of dating a literal child.
Do you not have to apply your reasoning to anyone who ever found you attractive?
As someone who was in the same shoes as the person you reacted to: I was absolutely repulsed. It’s the main reason why I waited until my late thirties to get a partner for life.
When I got the slightest whiff of the men being with me because he liked that I was short / skinny / childlike that was the end of the relationship. It’s not only superficial, but also highly questionable to find your partner attractive because of these traits.
That’s absolutely nuts. You think it’s akin to pedophilia to find an adult woman attractive. If only you ever actually read up on what exactly pedophilia is I think you would’ve saved yourself a lot of trouble. It is exclusively an attraction to children, it has absolutely nothing to do with being attracted to petite adult women.
Like can you explain what exactly is the moral delimma in finding an adult petite woman attractive?
It’s superficial to find your partner attractive because of their traits? That makes absolutely no sense. Finding literally anyone in the world attrative is inherently superficial, that’s how it works.
The women on the community in question don’t even look “barely legal” but well over 20 in most cases. People are losing their minds over nothing.
Yes as a survivor of abuse as a child I don’t see the big deal with thru decision.
Well no, they defederated because they have a problem with a community that tries to look like they’re underaged. Not individuals looking underaged but they’re saying they don’t like that there is a community for that type of content. It’s fine to disagree with them over the truth of that, but you shouldn’t change their reasoning.
Edit: see the very end of the chat on this comment https://lemmynsfw.com/comment/683605
I’m not sure what you mean about adorableporn trying to make anyone appear underage - I see no indication of that in the post in question, and that’s not the purpose of the community (it would even appear all non-OC posts must include proof of being above legal age). I’m not sure what your second sentence means. I had no intention of changing/mischaracterizing anyone’s post and I find it very ironic you say I did.
Whether or not that is what the purpose of that community is that is what the Blahaj admins believe the purpose of it is and that’s why they chose to defederate.
Edit: See the end of the chat in this comment, it shows what I am mentioning. https://lemmynsfw.com/comment/683605
They’re saying it’s (in their opinion, lemmynsfw admins disagree) a community devoted to crossing the line and appearing to be underaged. The Blahaj admins are saying that’s what the problem is, not just a few random users who look underaged.
How do you know they are verified adults? Just because someone on the internet posts a picture and says it is? I think it is absolutely warranted to put communities under intense scrutiny which accumulate such content.
How do you know anyone is a verified adult? A 17 year old can look like a 22 year old. Should we ban all porn unless its of verified adults? Should one need a license to use their body in pornography?
Do you verify everyone to be of age in all pornographic material you consume? Unless you do, there is a decent chance you’ve unknowingly seen pornographic content involving someone just not quite of age.
To answer your question more directly, pornography companies where images usually originate obviously don’t hire underage actors. Sites for posting/selling self pornography also require documents, but that’s pretty prone to forgery.
When it comes to self posting on social media, all bets are off. Someone not quite of age can post pornography of themselves on twitter or reddit or they can even post it on self hosted blog.
So you have 2 solutions: Ban all pornography of people who would be asked for a driver’s license when they are buying alcohol. So probably like 30+ years of age. Requires a government license to post pornography of self, which would also require disclosing your legal name and other identifiable information when posting pornography.
Or we can continue being pragmatic and use our best judgement while understanding that our perception can’t tell who is 17 years and 363 days old and who just turned 18.
Should we ban all porn unless its of verified adults?
Erm, of course we should? Seriously? I wouldn’t want to accidentally run into that on Lemmy. In an ideal world we obviously should.
Do you verify everyone to be of age in all pornographic material you consume?
I do not consume pornographic material.
Let’s get back to what is discussed here. I never said we should ban all porn or whatever you try to twist my words into.
When a community allows amateur porn that can not be verified, as you state yourself, an instance or person who wants to make somewhat sure they aren’t seeing porn from or about minors should defederate from that instance. Or a user should ban that community. This is especially true if the community hosts “barely legal” porn.
I agree. In this case the pictures in question include the model name, who you can research yourself and see is above 18. That community is strictly moderated, and requires model name, source, and age verification.
The blahaj admin defederating is totally fair, and it’s the whole point of the fediverse. The dragging the issue into the public view to cover up their own mistaken impression is absolutely silly. The public attack in the form of implication that the other admin is supporting CSAM is sickening. This person comes across as the type to manufacture drama to make themselves seem like a victim. Were I an instance admin, they would be exactly the kind of person I would want to defederate from, as nothing good comes from association with people who like to play victim for attention.
Welcome to the canceldon. Remember, you must purity spiral or else you’re the nazi.
It’s not that fucking serious.
it will be
Weird. It seems like they were concerned with adorableporn.
As if adorable is a trait that only children can have.
There can be no “wrong” between two or more consenting adults.
My ex-wife is a clinical sexologist and I myself almost got my doctorate in the field too
Taking the classes and reading the books really opened up my eyes how much happier people are when they throw convention to the wind and just be themselves with other like-minded people.
My ex-wife is a clinical sexologist and I myself almost got my doctorate in the field too
Did you miss the finals because of perfecting your career choice?
All kidding aside, I am honestly curious as to why you didn’t get your doctorate, if you’re very close to it, if you’re willing to tell the public about it?
I’m pretty severely physically disabled. I have a degenerative bone disease called polyostotic fibrous dysplasia with Mccune-Albright syndrome. My bone marrow is slowly turning into tumors, causing fractures as I walk, move, exist. It also causes my endocrine to go hyper, hypo, or just shut off at random. So I’m pretty sick.
I didn’t realize all the clinical hours needed for all the certificates and such that I needed to complete the doctorate. My body was just not letting me get the work in.
I was getting my higher educations at Sexology Institute in Miami semi remotely. Since we knew the dean personally, I asked if I could use my credits and go for another doctorate offered since I had all the core classes and a ton of sexology specific classes. The best one offered with no clinical requirements was a philosophy degree.
I wasn’t going to use it for work since I’m disabled. So I knew that I’d be able to use it for what I wanted to use it for, and that was teaching others, academia, life coaching, that sort of stuff.
It’s also super helpful in running businesses as you have a changed perspective in a lot of things.
I was also able to graduate on time too after putting in some extra hours. Another benefit, I suppose, of being disabled
Thank you for sharing, and sorry to hear about your health predicament. Hang in there.
Ye, they can honestly fuck off. I myself have that account on that instance and no illegal porn is present
Weird drama over nothing tbh
Communities are free to federate with whoever they want;
Consenting adults can do whatever they want.
Now give me a medal
Right.
You missed what the drama is over.
You can’t baselessly accuse whoever you want of posting and viewing CSAM because it looked like it to you, and then continuing to insist on that being the case after being proven wrong.
Yes you can. It’s been proven time and time again that you can in fact just do that. See the very continued existence of mastodon.art, for example
Weird drama over nothing tbh
Welcome to the Internet friendo! Now I must ask your attention for this unnecessarily long post to partake into your indirect attempt (yet it happened anyways) to trigger my emotions and my masculinity with your attempt to bruteforce common sense into our lovely community.
Please do apologize, or else I will forced to report you for ill-mannered behavior.
And if you reply to this, even if its the most sane-rational-intended – then you are a hater and you must cease any attempt to rationalization.
We are oppressed by the fascists enough as it is already.
Apologize. Now.
Sowwy 🥺
Now give me a medal
Here you go, friend.🏅
For having the most concise, rational take in the thread.
Lemmy needs more tools to help avoid defederation. Like the admins being able to block communities (defederating a community interested of the entire instance), or hide posts from a community/instance from c/All so people who are still subscribed or manually search can still find the posts
Also users should be able to block instances just for themselves, just posts or comments as well
It has those tools. They’re called “Run your own instance.”
It lets you federate with whoever you want.
I have the ability to block a community through the app I use, is this not built into Lemmy itself?
Users can block communities yeah but instance admins cannot. I think instance admins should be able to control what c/All shows to an extent. Figuring out which communities to block takes time and frustrates new users. I’ve seen multiple posts from users complaining about certain communities or posts showing up on c/All and not knowing or caring that they can block communities. And then you gotta think about anonymous browsing, I’m sure many users browse without an account or without logging in, for both Lemmy and Reddit and other sites too, users hate creating accounts no matter how easy you make it.
no, it’s an app trick. not all apps allow it. it’s on the roadmap to be integrated in lemmy itself btw.
Full post is visible from
lemmy.world, too: https://lemmy.world/post/2064026Not the first time that person was looking around for reasons to be outraged and ban communities. I hope they decide to go isolated and defederate from all instances.
Illegal content should be removed in any case, but there is nothing illegal here.
Trans servers usually are extremely trigger happy with anything they slightly disagree with, so this is very on brand
doesn’t have to be illegal, to be unwanted, if you want to see all that nsfw stuff, browse that instance and subscribe to it’s communities, the great many of us, don’t want that fucking disgusting bullshit on our feeds without requesting it, is the issue, you see
you can block communities in your settings but I kinda agree you should also be able to block whole instances as a user
Can you not opt out of seeing NSFW magazines? I see your acct is on kbin, pretty sure that’s an option.
Kbin users can even block a whole instance on a user-level as far as I’ve heard, which isn’t currently possible on Lemmy.
Where did all these puritans come from?
America, usually.
Are you serious? America literally has some of the biggest porn producers in the world
US is literally built by puritans. Which were forced out of Europe, because Europe didn’t like them.
Poof! That’s the sound of 20 million fundamentalists vanishing because you pointed out the existence of Brazzers
And some of the most vocal hypocrites. An entire major political party is essentially based on it and continuously tries to push puritanical beliefs on everyone.
But you can block whatever communities you want. I’ve blocked a lot of different communities that have content I don’t like, and now they’re not in my feed.
Why would you browse an unfiltered feed if it’s not what you want?
I always looked at it like walking down the street. Some people might disgust me, but it’s a shared space. Unless they persnoally harass me, I have no right to attack them.
Well maybe its unwanted by you, but it might be wanted by someone else.
I have no problem with anything having its space as long as its legal.
I never saw a NSFW post on lemmy actually, I have NSFW content hidden by default and it works great. Even though I am not interested in that content, I can respect that some people are.
This is also why I think banning communities because someone felt slightly offended is not the way to go. Lemmy already has a good way of moderating content per user, and you can ban communities and never see their content. I dont think instance admins should be removing anything other than illegal content.
I’m on kbin and haven’t seen nsfw content on my feed once, you can just turn off the NSFW content in settings
I have NSFW turned on and the last NSFW post I saw was literally just a picture of a cat.
I believe there’s some sort of ‘soft’ filter in place since there were tons of complaints about seeing NSFW posts on the front page. Should be worked out soonish
edit : NSFW shows up properly now
Illegal where? You can’t run a federated system and keep it functioning AND legal everywhere all the time. There are 100s of jurisdictions, each of them constantly changing the rules.
The fediverse is set up somewhere in the grey zone. It has all the disadvantages of decentralized system (has to communicate with untrusted peers), while also having all the disadvantages of centralized system (having childish admins, who are also bound by their local jurisdictions).
The general direction is good, and the p2p ecosystem is better than a decade ago, but this is still not the final form, I’m afraid.
I’m just glad that there’s a ton of money at stake in the big league, and large ISPs can’t afford to act like this most of the time.
Yes this is a honest concern, I tend to agree that there should be more freedom here, and things like piracy should be allowed. As well as total free speech, none of that paradox of tolerance bullshit everyone is trying to push whenever they want to censor someone.
However, I think though we can all agree that child abuse and CP is not allowed.
You can find an instance that supports the things you agree with (piracy and freedom in your case)
that paradox of tolerance bullshit
How is that bullshit?
Because it’s just a thought experiment that is taken dogmatically, while in reality is just used by fascists to censor the free speech
So, you have no arguments against it, you just don’t like that people use it to shut out intolerant discourse?
By the way, it’s not “just a thought experiment”. It’s a philosophical principle that Popper put out there as self-preservation for democratic societies. You can argue its merits all you want, but you haven’t so far.
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Uncomfortable seeing “free speech is a good thing “ downvoted
Sounds like they were trying to find a reason to defederate.
No, nsfw content is allowed on lemmy.blahaj.zone and Ive even stumbled on furry porn on a meme community (/c/196) so its not that.
If we are against lolicon for depicting children in such ways then its perfectly consistent being against stuff that use people (even if theyre adults) to do the same.
Its just IRL lolicon, Im with the admins of blahaj.zone in being against that.
If an instance is sharing content that another instance finds problematic, then defederation makes sense. Regardless, though, it seems like lemmynsfw is doing their due diligence to handle illegal content. We all know that porn will exist… having good stewards of those communities is vital. Punishing them for providing a (legal) porn platform is counterproductive.
there should be an instance filter for fediverse users so that unwanted content, namely all the crazy disgusting shit being posted on nsfw doesn’t automatically show up in users feeds
You can turn of NSFW content in your account settings if you find it objectionable. This is on both lemmy and kbin.
You’re on kbin. You already have a NSFW filter.
I think, like most people who seem to bitch about NSFW stuff on their feed, is that they want to filter out all the stuff they’re not into and leave all the stuff they are.
Which, while I sympathize with, is something they need to deal with themselves rather than something that someone should be doing for them. Back when reddit had NSFW content on all, there were a bunch of subreddits that I didn’t want to see. So I blocked them. Because my opinions are my responsibility, not anyone else’s.
Blocking individual communities / magazines is also possible on kbin. But I guess some people just want to cry for the sake of crying. The only thing that doesn’t quite work is blocking actual instances, which the GUI supports, but it does not actually block communities from that instance.
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It turns out that setting up an Internet social arena is really hard. They have existed for decades, and the core mechanics and content policy make a big difference in the vibe of the communities that arise on it. What may work initially then becomes toxic. It’s very hard to predict where you’ll end up once the Eternal September kicks in.
It’s not a solved problem at all!
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Ah, the good ol’ ‘administrator discretion’. Seems like a classic case of power-tripping site admins doubling down on their opinion while disregarding any notion that they may be in the wrong. Can’t say I’m surprised - it was only a matter of time before we saw this kind of behavior in the threadiverse.
Regardless of how you may feel about NSFW content on Lemmy, this is a huge red flag for lemmy.blahaj.zone, and I would advise against people joining that instance purely based on the admins’ apparent inability to properly investigate or understand the content that they federate with. Hopefully they can clarify their rules in the near future and justify why exactly this defederation happened, or reverse their decision, swallow a little bit of pride, and admit they were in the wrong.
EDIT: More admin correspondence can be found here.
Very ‘my way or the highway’ behavior from the blahaj.zone admins. Really not a good look.
Yeah, not really a huge fan of Ada after this. All this because somebody got confused and refuses to say they misunderstood and move on.
Sorry to the rest of the blahaj community that’s going down with the ship on this one.
I was there, I deleted my account and moved on.
It is clear that Ada did not look at the rest of the posts in the community in question. Because the post she had an issue with stands out as an exception to the community instead of being representative of the community. This was handled well by LemmyNSFW and not well by BlahajZone.
She was also banning a ton of people in that thread for “misgendering” her. Apparently she assumes everyone should open her profile to check her gender before replying.
There’s a lot of content I’m just not into - and I happily block those communities. But I would never want to inflict my own likes & dislikes on others. So I think a move like this is unenlightened.
But, I also think there needs to be an instance that fits everyone, and if lemmy.blahaz.zone wants to be the morality-police instance for their users, and their users like that, then more power to them.
Honestly feels like there are just a ton of anti-lgbt people jumping at the chance to hate on ada, this is quite a non-issue.
If people want to see and interact with porn then they can simply make an account on a porn server, that’s a good idea even regardless of all this.
I don’t understand the insistence that porn instances have to be federated with everyone else, it’s equally as strange as pornhub having a “share to facebook” button.
The issue isn’t the defederation, it’s that the instance is being presented as being at all fine with CSAM by blahaj admins, when it’s actually very postive, and moderated well by reasonable admins judging by the convo between them.
The blahaj admin fucked up, and rather than admitting they fucked up, they decided to drag the issue into the public sphere and infer the other instance supports CSAM. And don’t give me any bullshit about how that’s not really what they are doing, because that’s exactly how they worded their post. I’m guessing they did it because they wanted to create drama and play the victim, but whatever the reason, everyone else has every right to criticize them for their actions. What they did was pretty fucking shitty, and they should be ashamed of themselves.
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I don’t understand the insistence that porn instances have to be federated with everyone else
Most people don’t seem to be saying this. In fact, blahaj.zone does not seem to have a policy of defederating from porn instances in general.
Of course anyone running an instance can choose not to federate with any server for any reason, though most users might want to avoid instances that are inconsistent or unpredictable about it. The main issue here seems to be an accusation that lemmynsfw.com tolerates CSAM, or things meant to give the impression of being CSAM. That’s a serious accusation, which its admins deny.
My main account is on lemmynsfw, I don’t use it for porn. We are not the same.
I feel the need to point out, there is porn on both instances. Just more on lemmynsfw.
When using reddit we can access everything under one account. That is the point. If each instance need each account then there is no use. I should be able to open one account and access everything. If people are segregated into multiple instance and no connection between them then there is no use. Yeah if they are allowing posting of csam content etc then fine defederation is necessary.
I should be able to open one account and access everything.
This seems like a misunderstanding of how Fediverse works. It’s about voluntary association between instance owners. If you don’t like the decisions made by your instance owner, then the point of Fediverse is that you can either find an instance that thinks like you do, or make your own. It’s not about forcing owners to associate with other instances they dislike, even if you disagree with the reasoning.
There’s a bit of downside in that Lemmy doesn’t let you migrate accounts at this time, but it’s basically brand-new open source software. Whether you meant to or not, you signed up to be a user for an incomplete experience.
Well it’s a good thing there’s already a place where you can do that!
Welcome to the fediverse! Instance admins are under obligation to federate with every other instance possible, and are also under no obligation to do everything in their power to recapture the reddit experience.
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