- cross-posted to:
- [email protected]
- cross-posted to:
- [email protected]
cross-posted from: https://lemmy.ml/post/20788199
Jessica Corbett
Sep 27, 2024
You must log in or register to comment.
Just war crime after war crime at this point.
And why not? He has virtually unlimited U.S. weapons as well as bi-partisan support from U.S. politicians. It’s as though we’re just setting our attack dog loose on everyone.
It’s fucking astonishing that we have any relationship with Israel at all these days. The U.S. gets absolutely nothing out of this one-sided relationship.
Israel offers us:
-No unique strategic military position (we have that area covered already).
-No high-value industrial benefits (no natural resources or unique trade).
-No military arsenal or manpower support (their arsenal comes from us and their personnel is quite limited).
It’s time to let them make friends with their neighbors on their own. They don’t need us to do that and we sure as fuck don’t need them.
The US is a parent sitting and watching its problem child beat the shit out of the other children in the playpark. Other concerned parents keep asking the US to do something, to which they shrug and say “kids will be kids, what can you do” while handing their child a knuckleduster.
Hacking and Blackmail are Israeli strengths. The two most common theories I hear are that that elected officials are impressed with the Israeli hacking capabilities and rather keep them on our side, or they are actively exploiting those capabilities to bend politicians to their will. Seeing how Israel operates in public with innocent civilians it seems rather obvious our predicament.
Israel controlling politicians via blackmail seems to be the obvious truth for a long time.
Also a lot of technologies and systems good for collecting material for blackmail come from Israel or are associated with it. ICQ and Viber, for example. While Telegram is apparently unofficially associated.
There were rumors of Epstein’s connections to Israel and that his island was most of intended for collecting such material.
There’s plenty of spyware coming from Israel sold to governments and such.
There have been a few Israeli operations of the nature supporting that spying is what they do most, and exactly in the way most convenient for blackmail, and all the rest being secondary.
But these are not as important as for Israelis themselves it being absolutely normal to say that yes, that’s what Mossad does and should do, that’s its job - to get power base for Israel’s interests, blackmail of politicians and any crime involved. They put it in that “desperate need for survival” framing, but it’s the common idea for them.
And while what Israel does currently is disgusting, I would dream of Armenians ever having such an influence net. With very few limitations on means to achieve it.
Highly recommend the book One Nation Under Blackmail by Whitney Webb. Yes it’s entirely possible the currency we trade with Israel is intelligence based
Will read, thanks.
I didn’t name the solution - the solution is the culture of coming clear, and the culture of it being followed up by the wide society, and the culture of legal relativity - as in Watergate, it was, ahem, illegal to break into someone’s office, but that’s not the important part.
If a politician today admits to things they’ve done that Mossad can blackmail them with - I’d expect rape, pedophilia, murders for pleasure, all that, because bribes alone are almost legal and it’s very rare that someone gets prosecuted, - they’ll be crucified for the act, their punishment won’t be made softer by them coming clear, and the worst part is that there won’t be any real investigation of the blackmailers.
There should be widespread understanding of the threats. All the cockroaches should be brought to light.
The problem with hacking and intelligence is they’re vulnerable to hard power. In other words you can hack stuff but you’re not going to hack your way out of Delta raiding your office. If Israel is using their hacking and intelligence to blackmail politicians then they’re constantly one fuck away from “find out”.
But they do have AIPAC, which likes to pedal its influence into local US politics.
Agreed! (Emphasis on the “greed”)
Unfortunately, as long as we leave political offices to be filled by the worst of us this will continue. Voting is only half the battle.
Main thing the US gets from Israel is Market Capital Export.
Israel accounts for what, like 30-40% of all recent American acquired startups?
Do you have a source for this?
My understanding is the primary trade between the U.S and Israel is diamonds. We each export over $1B worth of diamonds and also each import over $1B worth of diamonds between one another. In the past year, the U.S. imported about half a billion dollars more from Israel than it exported to Israel (again mostly diamonds in both directions).
The diamond trade between our countries does not justify our participation in unnecessary wars (or genocides) in my opinion. It seems unlikely to be the reason we are so committed to this relationship. I think AIPAC’s financial involvement in our elections represents a much bigger reason we support Israel.
“Diamonds”
Money laundering from countries we don’t want to deal with or are under sanctions.
They did the same with south Africa under apartheid, sold SA oranges as Israeli.
Biden instantly sending 8 Billion dollars in weapons really says it all. The US is planning to let Netanyahu bomb everything he wants. When they strike back in kind the US will use it as a pretense send in troops to start a war with Iran.
A smart move by Netanyahu. He knows he needs to get rid of Iran or they will outpace Israel. Now that Israel fully controls America this is the time to start their war with Iran with impunity.
One day before the bombing of Nasrallah (with advance knowledge and US cooperation). But after Israel started their recent Lebanon bombing campaign.
Everything the US does starts to make sense when you realize the US government is fully owned by lobbyists and wealthy donors. The Military Industrial Complex is a trillion dollar for-profit industry with the deepest pockets in the world. The capitalists who profit from it effectively own our country.
They don’t fully control America though. Most of us didn’t even realize the actual situation until this year. The Palestinians just got lumped in under terrorism and that was that. The new media exposure is turning that around. If you look at our response to apartheid in South Africa it’s tracking pretty closely. The halls of power didn’t want to care and the people forced them to care.
The worst part is the behavior of Netanyahu’s Israel is making people sympathetic to facism and Nazism, something unseen since the 1930s.
it’s quite easy to detest Nazis and Zionists.
very similar ideologies
ya, they are both fascists
The behavior of Netanyahu isn’t making people sympathetic to fascism nor German fascism. the behavior of Netanyahu is literally fascist, the people calling out against Netanyahu are literally the opposite of sympathetic to fascism, fascism is way more than “Jew bad”, in fact the whole antisemitism is more coincidental as Jews were a larger minority group, and fascism targeted all minority groups, with Jews being the largest they also had a larger target on their backs in comparisons to other groups that also went off to the camps.
Yup. Although to be fair it was always there lurking. There was always a part of America that dreamed about killing, exiling, and/or enslaving half the country.
deleted by creator
They don’t fully control America though.
You might want to check the list before making these claims.
Even if contributions guaranteed policy that still speaks to my point of an elite that wants to support an apartheid government and a people waking up and getting mad about it.
Israel does not “fully control” America (literally an antisemitic conspiracy theory).
It is literally the other way around: The US controls Israel and has the power to make them stop their genocide but chooses to send them more waepons to use for more war crimes.
I really don’t like french cheese. Am I racist with the french for that?
I really think that Germany has too much power over EU. Does this make me racist with Germans?
I understand some antisemitic may use war as a way to spread their idepology but the opposite is not true.
One person may disagree with the geopolic of this war without having any issue with the citizens of a country involved
I really don’t like french cheese. Am I racist with the french for that?
No
I really think that Germany has too much power over EU. Does this make me racist with Germans?
Germany is the country with the most seats in the EU parliament. The influence of germany is not a conspiracy theory, but a fact, therefore: No
Are Israeli politicians members of congress ? Or the house ? Ok, so maybe the comparison is bullshit.
One person may disagree with the geopolic of this war without having any issue with the citizens of a country involved
Yes, correct.
Not sure what that has to do with the fact that America is on the side of genocide of its own free will instead of being secretly controlled by Israel into being on the side of genocide 🤷
Politicians are literally committing treason in service to zionism. Not just the majority who are completely bought but also those who openly serve a foreign regime.
Yes they are ideologically aligned with zionism, that does not mean they are controlled by Israel.
The outcome is similar, the analysis and legal ramifications are very different.
Yes, many are bought by AIPAC. AIPAC works to the benefit of the Israel, but it recieves it’s funding from wealthy american christian zionists. Again, aligned with zionism, not controlled by Israel, not the same.
I really think that Germany has too much power over EU. Does this make me racist with Germans?
Doesn’t Germany have the largest population of all EU countries? It makes sense that the country with the largest population and largest economy might also have more influence than lower population countries.
Best I can do is giving him more bombs
The companies making military weapons and gear for Israel can be found here according to AFSC.
The US has committed grants to Israel to buy weapons through 2028. It’s benefiting the above corporations. While not all US based, it still is just another example of our corporate overlords fiucking the world over for profits).
Is there somewhere they are separated by country? Would be helpful to people who want to know what they should demonstrate against in their country.
Reagab stopped them from doing this exact same thing 40 years ago. Anyone still gonna say this administration isn’t more Zionist than usual?
Hasn’t every administration slowed them down except for Biden’s?
Trump. Obama was the last one to hold them accountable for anything.
And Trump’s but basically yeah.
Trump let them off the leash, and they went feral.
Once they knew they could do whatever they wanted they decided it was better to beg forgiveness than ask permission.
Then they decided it was better to not even beg forgiveness and just do what they wanted anyway.
He’s dead. Article states he lived.
Do people hate Netanyahu because Trump supports him or because of his actions? Kinda like how people hate Putin because they think he’s friends with Trump?
I think you need to know that your take is wrong.
I may be shit posting, but I’m interested in people’s opinions as well. Because especially on reddit, people always say “this because of that”
Also, I like to read replies to shit posts.
I mean I wouldn’t call your posts shitposting.
I don’t know a single person nor have I ever seen a single person say “hey trumps friend, Putin is kinda nuts…”
Yeah, I’ve never seen people hate Putin cause of Trump. I have seen a couple cases of the other way around, Republicans hating Trump cause of Putin.
Yea. Im going to assume that dude above my comment is either a bad faith commenter or just stuck in a bubble.
That’s what I meant, actually , the latter part
Nah. It’s because he’s killing people to gain territory. Terrorists, kids don’t matter.
For some reason the U.S. is cool with that but not so when Russia is doing it to Ukraine.
deleted by creator
I’ll reply with a question:
Did most Americans only “learn” about how Putin operates after his link to Trump was spelled out?
It’s not like Putin’s playbook has ever changed during my lifetime… (for the record I think what Putin has been doing in Syria and the old Soviet isn’t right).
I love how you managed to thread all the needles into being wrong about reality quite intricately.
Residential buildings that Hezbollah intentionally set up a headquarters in the basement of.
Thats already a war crime by Hezbollah.
Firstly, being the second one to commit a war crime does not make the act of doing so any less heinous.
Secondly, do you have any actual evidence you’re basing that on, or is it just Israel’s word you’re taking? Because we know for a fact that Israel bombed civilians, and as far as I’ve seen, it’s just hearsay that they were targeting actual Hezbollah members. On the other hand, we do know for fact that they’ve used this justification falsely before, so I’m disinclined to believe anything they say, frankly.
You want evidence?? Are you some kind of antisemite?? /s
Secondly, do you have any actual evidence you’re basing that on, or is it just Israel’s word you’re taking?
I mean, high ranking Hezbollah members do keep dying in these strikes, possibly including Nasrallah in this latest one. Sure Israel are still dicks for accepting the levels of civilian casualties that come along with it but the strikes do seem to be hitting actual targets.
The targets (so far):
Israel killed more than 700 people, including 50 children and 94 women, in air strikes it conducted across Lebanon since September 23.
At least 1,835 Lebanese people were wounded in the attacks, the country’s Ministry of Public Health said.
In addition to the entire genocide still going on in Gaza and ramping up in the West Bank
Being detered by human shields means that more human shields are used. It’s the same logic as refusing to pay ransom for kidnappers. The opposite would just encourage more kidnappings.
It’s literally terrorist 101 to use human shields. This tactic has been used by every insurgency in the last hundred years.
It’s why it was added as a war crime.
As for the second one to commit a war crime. If you follow the rules, but your enemy doesn’t, you will lose. This is the international equivalent of the bunch buggy no punch back bullshit that let’s people hit you with no retaliation.
Repeating the same lies “human shields” and “terrorist” doesn’t make it true.
The leader of Hezbollah was confirmed dead in the attack, so clearly they were using human shields… They have been attacking Israel from a foreign country, and are not part of that countries military, which makes them terrorists.
You don’t like the truth, but lying about it doesnt change the facts of the matter.
It makes them a paramilitary organization. They’re fulfilling their duty under international law to stop genocide.
They’re committing war crimes constantly. Attacking civilians and using human shields by building their bases in residential buildings.
They aren’t fulfilling any sort of duty.
What about repeating the Truth? Because that’s what he’s actually doing.
The IDF uses Palestinians as human shields.
There are literal videos of this.
Unfortunately it’s not the IDF’s job to protect Palestinians. Don’t know 'bout Hezollah.
It’s the IDF job not to commit war crimes.
So Isrealis are terrorists? We have actual video of them using human shields.
Yes? I’ve never claimed they aren’t bad. The US does it too, along with pretty much every country who goes to war because international law and the rules of war are bullshit.
There are no rules in war other than “win”
This should be fun. Where uh… Where’s the US policy on using human shields?
The “everybody does it” argument is complete bullshit, but I’d love to see your evidence that the US routinely and as a matter of standard procedure uses human shields.
Well, it’s asymmetrical warfare. It works like that. You want everyone to line up in straight lines across a football field and take turns firing?
I purpose we have all the world’s nations choose one competitive video game, and then everyone develops their gaming team, then all potential military disputes are settled by a best of five match of the chosen game.
No wallhax.
Yes it does work like that, and bombing them anyways is the counter.
Would be nice if we had an easier way to solve problems, but it’s not realistic.
Fucks sake, this again?
Benny just can’t help him.
That’s what so many are unwilling to aknowledge. Civilian deaths are only issue for the western nations. Not to these extremists. Being martyred lands them into heaven. Not only is this a non-issue for them but it’s actually a good thing. They get to heaven and western media will slam Israel for it. Win-win.
Oh no, people are willing to die for their homes? Craaaaaazy.
Not willing to, but having to because there’s a terrorist HQ / ammunation storage in the basement or a missile launcher on the school / mosque / hospital yard that they themselves didn’t agree to.
Man you go from “that apartment and all people inside were terrorists” to “oh the civilians actually also hate these terrorists” real quick. The line between civilian or terrorist is whatever you want.
Residential buildings that Hezbollah intentionally set up a headquarters in the basement of.
At no point has anyone claimed it’s only been terrorists in those buildings.
Just cool with targeting civilians then. Damn. Normally y’all genocidal freaks like to do a little double talk to avoid saying it.
Attacking me personally (ad hominem) for a view I don’t even hold isn’t an argument against what I’m actually saying. I don’t know what you imagine you’re achieving with this inflammatory style of commenting and strawmanning your opponent’s arguments.
your comment will be downvoted coz lemmy is full of left wingers who prefers to instill their lame ass rhetorics than see the fact that it was hamas and their asswipe cronies that handed israel the reason on a silver platter.
lets not forget,these hamas terrorist supporters had no qualms using civilians as shields,israel just decided to even the playong field.
You don’t think they’re well past evening the playing field by now?
It’s not about winning the fight, it’s about ensuring they are never considered a viable target again.
israel lost the plot,that much is certain.
as of now,hamas handed israel the golden key and israel will not hesitate to use it to the fullest.
genocide or not,until hamas is exterminated,israel will not face any consequences for their actions.
At what point should they have consequences? They can’t keep bombing civilians without consequence
Removed by mod
Sounds familiar
Dehumanization refers to the act of perceiving victimized subgroups as not completely human. Psychologists distinguish between two types of non-humanness: one that denies uniquely human attributes to others by comparing them to animals
“I have ordered a complete siege on the Gaza Strip. There will be no electricity, no food, no fuel, everything is closed,” “We are fighting human animals and we are acting accordingly"
- Yoav Gallant Minister of Defense
“Those are animals, they have no right to exist. I am not debating they way it will happen, but they need to be exterminated”.
-
Yoav Kisch Minister of Education
-
Law for Palestine Releases Database with 500+ Instances of Israeli Incitement to Genocide
still not changing my mind nor stance.
end hamas,then you can come highlighting how bad israel is.
If the only thing stopping you from doing war crimes is a reason then your a scumbag.
- you’re
Grammer Nazi. Gottem
sieg heil.
“This is the only story of mine whose moral I know,” writes Kurt Vonnegut at the beginning of his 1962 novel Mother Night. “I don’t think it’s a marvelous moral; I simply happen to know what it is: We are what we pretend to be, so we must be careful about what we pretend to be.”
heil.
Stop pushing this BS to justify Israel’s Genocide. On the subject of Human Shields, there are some independent reports for past conflicts of Hamas jeopardizing the safety of civilians via Rocket fire in dense urban areas, two instances during Oct 7th, but no independent verification since then so far. None of which absolve Israel of the crime of targeting civilians under international law:
Intentionally utilizing the presence of civilians or other protected persons to render certain areas immune from military attack is prohibited under international law. Amnesty International was not able to establish whether or not the fighters’ presence in the camps was intended to shield themselves from military attacks. However, under international humanitarian law, even if one party uses “human shields”, or is otherwise unlawfully endangering civilians, this does not absolve the opposing party from complying with its obligations to distinguish between military objectives and civilians or civilian objects, to refrain from carrying out indiscriminate or disproportionate attacks, and to take all feasible precautions to spare civilians and civilian objects.
Additionally, there is extensive independent verification of Israel using Palestinians as Human Shields: IDF uses Human Shields, including Children (2013 Report), and in the latest war Israel “Systematically” Uses Gaza Children as Human Shields, Rights Group Finds
Removed by mod
Opens your mouth but ain’t prepared to deal with gasp evidence…?
Facts, not feelings, and the fact of the matter is you are a genocidal person.
don’t care and even if i was genocidal,what can you do?
No surprise you deflect and lie about my position. I’m an advocate for equal rights. Take your own advice and recognize that the hundreds of thousands dead at the hands of Israel are human beings just like you and me.
Hamas has already agreed to no longer govern the Gaza Strip, as long as Palestinians receive liberation and a unified government can take place. Israel has been the only one to reject the UN Resolution 3-Stage Permanent Ceasefire put forth by the US.
Quote
During the current war, Hamas officials have said that the group does not want to return to ruling Gaza and that it advocates for forming a government of technocrats to be agreed upon by the various Palestinian factions. That government would then prepare for elections in Gaza and the West Bank, with the intention of forming a unified government.
Before that, both Hamas and Fatah have agreed to a Two-State solution based on the 1967 borders for decades. Oslo and Camp David were used by Israel to continue settlements in the West Bank and maintain an Apartheid, while preventing any actual Two-State solution
Israel has always been the obstacle for peace, because it is a Settler Colonialist Ethnostate founded on, and ever continuing, ethnic cleansing
Settlements
Israel justifies the settlements and military bases in the West Bank in the name of Security. However, the reality of the settlements on-the-ground has been the cause of violent resistance and a significant obstacle to peace, as it has been for decades.
This type of settlement, where the native population gets ‘Transferred’ to make room for the settlers, is a long standing practice.
- See: The Concept of Transfer 1882-1948, the Transfer Committee, and the JNF which led to Forced Displacement of 100,000 Palestinians throughout the mandate before the Nakba
The mass ethnic cleansing campaign of 1948:
Further, declassified Israeli documents show that the Occupation of the West Bank and Gaza Strip were deliberately planned before being executed in 1967:
While the peace process was exploited to continue de-facto annexation of the West Bank via Settlements
The settlements are maintained through a violent apartheid that routinely employs violence towards Palestinians and denies human rights like water access, civil rights, etc. This kind of control gives rise to violent resistance to the Apartheid occupation, jeopardizing the safety of Israeli civilians.
State violence – official and otherwise – is part and parcel of Israel’s apartheid regime, which aims to create a Jewish-only space between the Jordan River and the Mediterranean Sea. The regime treats land as a resource designed to serve the Jewish public, and accordingly uses it almost exclusively to develop and expand existing Jewish residential communities and to build new ones. At the same time, the regime fragments Palestinian space, dispossesses Palestinians of their land and relegates them to living in small, over-populated enclaves.
The apartheid regime is based on organized, systemic violence against Palestinians, which is carried out by numerous agents: the government, the military, the Civil Administration, the Supreme Court, the Israel Police, the Israel Security Agency, the Israel Prison Service, the Israel Nature and Parks Authority, and others. Settlers are another item on this list, and the state incorporates their violence into its own official acts of violence. Settler violence sometimes precedes instances of official violence by Israeli authorities, and at other times is incorporated into them. Like state violence, settler violence is organized, institutionalized, well-equipped and implemented in order to achieve a defined strategic goal.
One or Two State Solution
The settlements represent land-grabbing, and land-grabbing and peace-making don’t go together, it is one or the other. By its actions, if not always in its rhetoric, Israel has opted for land-grabbing and as we speak Israel is expanding settlements. So, Israel has been systematically destroying the basis for a viable Palestinian state and this is the declared objective of the Likud and Netanyahu who used to pretend to accept a two-state solution. In the lead up to the last election, he said there will be no Palestinian state on his watch. The expansion of settlements and the wall mean that there cannot be a viable Palestinian state with territorial contiguity. The most that the Palestinians can hope for is Bantustans, a series of enclaves surrounded by Israeli settlements and Israeli military bases.
- Avi Shlaim
How Avi Shlaim moved from two-state solution to one-state solution
‘One state is a game changer’: A conversation with Ilan Pappe
Hamas officials should be held accountable for all war crimes committed, same as all Israeli officials. That said, there are many parallels between the Warsaw Ghetto Uprising and Gaza.
In the Shadow of the Holocaust by Masha Gessen, the situation in Gaza is compared to the Warsaw Ghettos. The comparison was also made by a Palestinian poet who was later killed by an Israeli airstrike. Adi Callai, an Israeli, has also written on the parallels in his article The Gaza Ghetto Uprising and expanded upon in his corresponding video
Removed by mod
Removed by mod
deleted by creator
false equivalence…but if that’s what you believe,fuck if I care.
